There’s a better way…

…to make your point.

I’ll warn you, there’s a rant here; if you’re not a fan of those, navigate away while you still can!

I booted up the laptop this morning to check the comments, and read through the ones on yesterday’s post first, noting the pingback from The Noisy Rogue.  Then I checked the comment from my now year old how to guide on PvE Combat.  This gem from Syylence was waiting for me:

This spec is no longer the best way for a combat rogue to go in 3.3 +. I am pulling up to 10 k single target in some fights on my rogue now in ICC. Rupture is a bad glyph to use and should not be in your rotation either. Its basic now keep s&d up all the time evis at 4 to 5 combo points use cooldowns when ever you are able and in combination with other thing IE blood lust or trinks. But dont use this spec anymore!

I’m really not sure where to begin, but this comment irked me enough that I decided it needed a reply in the form of a post rather than a comment.

First of all.  I get it.  The guide hasn’t been updated since 3.1, and that’s ok.  I never wrote it with players who were wearing anything close to BiS gear in mind.  The players who are actually using the Combat guide are generally players who are newer to the class and are still gearing up.  These players generally do not have enough Armor Pen to make the Ruptureless spec substantially better than one I posted many moons ago.  In fact, at lower gear levels, running Ruptureless is  loss of DPS.  When they get to that point, there’s a little thing called Elitist Jerks that can tell them how to maximize their DPS.

Second, there’s something to be said for respect, and this comment shows a clear lack of it.  I could care less if someone disagrees with me.  It’s part of the gig.  But the way this person went about it usually sets me off.  Let’s break this comment down…

This spec is no longer the best way for a combat rogue to go in 3.3 +.

 There’s nothing wrong with this statement, and I don’t refute it.  In fact, in the 115 comments on the post, it’s already been brought up and discussed.  I don’t use that spec anymore either.  I’m currently rocking a Ruptureless  20/51/0 as my offspec, but I have the gear to support it as well.

I am pulling up to 10 k single target in some fights on my rogue now in ICC.

Here’s where the comment starts to go awry.  First of all, great for you.  However, telling people you can pull x DPS isn’t going to make them more likely to listen to you.  I can top 25 man meters on multi-target fights, including Marrowgar, even though I play Assassination.  However, despite the perfect forum for tooting my own horn, I don’t post about the quantity of DPS that I can pull. 

Very few people care about how much DPS you can pull, just as they’re probably not interested in hearing about my latest recount numbers.  I’m sure that you were just trying to assert yourself as being competent enough to make the comment, but it’s really not necessary, and quite possibly turned people off from what you had to say.

Rupture is a bad glyph to use and should not be in your rotation either.

That’s debatable.  Consider if you’re undergeared and still using Rupture.  Believe it or not, when you ding 80, you’re not just handed a set of gear with a 5k score.  Also, you might only be lucky enough to get the gear that’s packed with Haste, and not Armor Pen.  There’s something to be said about running with a spec like 20/51/0 where the talents maximize poison damage, but without enough Armor Pen, Rupture can outperform Eviscerate.

Its basic now keep s&d up all the time evis at 4 to 5 combo points use cooldowns when ever you are able and in combination with other thing IE blood lust or trinks.

Please don’t insult the intelligence of the readers of this blog.  It’s been basic to keep S&D up for a long time.  The idea of saving trinkets and cooldowns for Bloodlust / Heroism is also not new.  That being said, waiting on a cooldown for an excessive amount of time just to line it up with Blood / Hero can actually be a loss of DPS.

But dont use this spec anymore!

This was the final straw that threw me over the edge.  I make it a point of pride that I tell people to take what I say with a grain of salt.  I would never tell another player how to play their game.  The people in my raids are free to use whatever spec they would like to.  If they’re not cutting it as a player, that’s one thing, but I don’t think it’s my place to tell someone how to play their game.  I’ll be glad to offer suggestions, but I’m not going to force someone to respec.

How would I comment on this post?  probably like this:


Your guide is out of date.  I’m currently using the spec XX/XX/XX which, according to Elitist Jerks, is the best raiding Combat spec.  My rotation consists mainly of keeping Slice and Dice up, as well as using 4-5 point Eviscerates.  I save my cooldowns and trinkets for Heroism / Bloodlust.  Since you wouldn’t be using Rupture, I’d replace that glyph with glyph of xxxxxxx.  Let me know what you think

– Commenter

That comment is much more respectful, and players might be inclined to listen to it and try it out. 

In the end, I’ve got few issues with what was said, just how it was said.  It’s no secret that the guide is out of date and needs to be updated, as does the Assassination version.  However, with the removal of Armor Pen as a stat  in Cataclysm and Rupture gaining the ability to crit, I’m sure we’ll all be acquainted with it again in the near future.

– Sam

13 Responses to There’s a better way…

  1. Tam says:

    On the other hand, the commenter in question could just have read the fucking discussion and maybe, y’know, checked the date of post before decided to get his wang out. Sorry, I’d be infuriated if I was you as well, it just really annoys me how eager people are to point out that things are, to their tiny mind, wrong (and not in the polite “not sure if you’ve covered this but..” way) without actually bothering to pay attention to way they’re criticising.

  2. Strikyn says:

    I agree with you Sam. I’ve followed your blog for a long time as well and if that poster had just taken the time to actually read the post and the replies they might have noticed the updates in the comments as things slowly changed. Still really looking forward to seeing your updated guides when you get the chance to complete them.

  3. Lexassin says:

    Hay lex here
    I love your guide and still (sadly) follow your pre 3.1 spec….. I’m waiting for your new spec to follow, on saying that.. I’m still new to the “proper eteket” (not sure on the spelling of that) and can’t realy understand why I need to be booted from raids and such for bein in the wrong spec..? But ohs wells… I’m learning and trying to get it righ and I read the forums and posts that you put up. I feal there is a bit of a rant in there haha so I’ll happaly wait for an update and /endrant 🙂
    Sinsearly lex, keep up the good work

  4. Lyndiana says:

    In theory, you shouldn’t be booted from raids if you have an appropriate spec, and if you are using Sam’s, I’m certain that even if it’s slightly out-of-date it won’t kill you. But remember, it’s considered a leveling spec (correct me if I’m wrong Sam!) and you may need a “real” raiding spec, glyphs, enchants, etc to be competitive. However, there are plenty of players in this game who will kick you for whatever reason they choose, including you not fitting their “cookie-cutter” version of a rogue spec. You probably don’t want to be raiding with those kinds of people anyway. But you can always ask Sam to look over your spec and give you some ideas if you are concerned. His email link is right under his picture on the main site, if you want to send him your armory link.

  5. protflashes says:

    Well said, sir! I understood very little of the rogue-speak, but the attitude-speak was loud and clear!

  6. samueltempus says:

    Nope Lyndi, this was a response to a raiding build.


    – Sam

  7. Sanomi says:

    Well… I am sure it’s un-intentional.
    But I do agree the last sentence does kinda create some fire-starting quality sparks =X

  8. arleff says:

    I think your original commentator needs to spend more time working on Subtlety or least being subtle 🙂

  9. Lyndiana says:


    Thanks for the correction. 🙂

  10. Abe says:

    As a newcomer to Slice and Dice, I find the articles insightful, humorous, and interesting. Playing a rogue has been a frustrating venture, but that was before I was introduced to this guide, courtesy of a guildie. Needless to say, I am now an avid reader.

    As for that comment left on your guide, I believe in a little thing called karma. And that is all that I can say civilly. Any more and this small little post would turn into a manifesto.

    Keep up the good work. I look forward to the updated guides. Until then, I’ll still be using the 3.1 guides to tweak my rogue.

  11. Ab says:

    Hello Sam,

    Good post Sam:
    Even though I started playing my rogue (@80) past 3.1, I used your guide to get a basic idea of how the rogue mechanics worked and found them very insightfull and easy to understand. Good starting rotation/advice to learn how a rogue works at 80 and then develop a personal style.

    The “end” style/talents depends on personal play-style and preference. Sure, theoretical I might squeeze out a little more DPS by going Sword instead of CQC and dropping rupture for the ruptureless cycle, but its less fun!, so I dont use it. In other words let People decide for them selfs how they want to play and stick to giving advice!

  12. Ab says:

    Update from

    “My rogue dps for dummies part 1 post gets linked in a lot of places around the net. I got a lot of grief for that when I put it up, and even worse it was my own fault as I hadn’t done enough research on what I was writing. my post was all over the place and I got called out for it, as you can see by the comments. And even though the commenter didn’t do it in a nice way, he was right. And I corrected my post. And I tried to learn from my mistake.”

    In my opinion s very adult way to respond by “the noisy rogue”`, so maybe leave this rant post for what it is?

  13. Elegantdeath says:

    Well, 99.99% of us have read and will continue to read your blog. Thanks for all the advice and conversations.

    I had some spare gold so duel-spec’d Subtlety. The talents look insane for some quick pvp work! Think I’ll head off and practice.

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